Hi,
Let's update changing self-defeating behavior learn-in.
Paul Mayer
Let's update changing self-defeating behavior learn-in.
Paul Mayer
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PaulMayer |
Let's update changing self-defeating behavior learn-in. |
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Posts: 32 (07/30/08 01:52 PM) |
Hi,
Let's update changing self-defeating behavior learn-in. Paul Mayer |
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BillSoltas |
Re: Let's update changing self-defeating behavior learn-in. | ||
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Posts: 21 (07/31/08 12:45 PM) |
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JayneBurgos |
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Posts: 38 (08/03/08 02:06 PM) |
Reposted by Jayne Burgos.
1zn asks: "On the emotional level, guilt and regret can cause a person to repeat behavior. Isn't punishment sometimes based on the mistaken assumption that guilt and regret will cause someone to stop doing a behavior? Is punishment appropriate? Why or why not?" 1zn regret is an appropriate emotion and guilt is a challenging and often self-defeating emotion. There's nothing wrong with regreting we did something. It reminds us we did something we best not have done. In regret we might empathize with another we wronged. Regret isn't self-damning like guilt. Guilt on the other hand isn't a very helpful emotion. It's constructed of Jehovian "should" or "must" demands that we didn't fulfill and we turn around and condemn ourselves. "You "shouldn't" have pimp-slapped Freddy. You no good lout!" As a motivational tool guilt doesn't seem very effective. Millions of people feel guilty about their misbehavior and "sins" and yet keep on doing them. In some cases guilt will cause persons to repeat self-defeating behaviors because of guilt's stressing emotional atmosphere. Think of alcoholics who become guilty (self-condemning) about their behavior and go out and drink to help drown their guilt. Regret and empathy appear to be more motivating in getting folks to mend their ways. Guilt and it's pain can actually distract someone from their poor behavior and changing it. Guilt also builds up a negative self-image that may make the individual continue acting in self-defeating ways. "Isn't punishment sometimes based on the mistaken assumption that guilt and regret will cause someone to stop doing a behavior?" 1zn Guilt can be self-punitive because someone condemns themselves with a negative self-label which can make someone feel badly. Regret isn't punitive because no negative self-labeling is involved. Once negative self-labeling is involved then it becomes guilt. Regret is a preference with no self-knocking. Punishment, according to studies, can deter some folks from doing certain behaviors. Punishment here is the deprivation of certain activities or freedoms. The challenge is the overuse of punishment where someone becomes desensitized to it or the person feels resentful about it because they believed they didn't deserve it. Corporal punishment often gets resentment. If overused it loses it's sting because people become desensitized to it. On some folks, such as sociopaths, punishment has little deterence. They can't connect punishment with their future. They don't think things through and they might have come from highly punitive backgrounds where they became desensitized to it. (Some folks even theorize that some sociopaths might seek punishment as a form of attention) Some punishments are employed by "eye for an eye" folks who want to magically even accounts. This kind of punishment is seldom corrective. "Is punishment appropriate? Why or why not?" 1zn If the punishment is judicious and is of the depriving nature rather than physically hurtful it will have some deterring effects if it is not overused. In some cases getting someone to notice others have feelings and needs may be helpful in building ethically based behavior. ***In your previous post in the "updating changing self-defeating behavior" you mentioned that people ought to "completely accept their self-defeating behavior". While I see a need to acknowledge our behavior, it can be problematic to accept a behavior that is self-defeating. This can make changing or removing the behavior difficult. Accepting the behavior might remove our motivation for changing or removing the behavior. It can also create a split in how we think about the behavior. It's tough to make a behavior both acceptable and self-defeating. Full acknowledgement of the behavior let's us know the behavior is there and can also help us in seeing a behavior's parts and patterns. What better be done too is to fully accept ourselves and not the behavior. Remember that many millions of folks mended their ways without accepting their behavior. They did need to acknowledge their behavior.*** Take care, Steve |
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HannahMartz |
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Posts: 14 (08/07/08 08:54 PM) |
Hi,
Self-acceptance is a good start in not engaging in self-defeating behavior. Hannah Repost Self Acceptance (c) Steve Mensing The keystone of many challenging emotional and behavioral difficulties is the very human habit of rating ourselves up and down by our behaviors and traits. Often folks label themselves as failures or rejects because they didn't perform so well on some task or got rejected. In inferiority and self-downing we encounter the problem of equating ourselves with our actions and traits. Our actions and traits are important, yet if we own poor behaviors or traits such as smoking or being unemployed these describe only two of our behaviors and traits. Anytime we choose to rate our "self" by a single or even a few traits or behaviors, we will be grossly overgeneralizing about our "self". To rate ourselves by our actions and traits is both arbitrary and self-defeating. BECAUSE WE BEHAVE FOOLISHLY IN SOME AREA OF OUR LIVES THIS WILL NOT MAKE YOU A "FOOL". We are multi-faceted persons with many, many positive, neutral, and some negative qualities. As multi-faceted persons we are so complicated that any form of self-rating is nonsense. Each of us possess millions of traits and behaviors (some ongoing and some in the past). How many points do we get for each trait and behavior? How many points for eye color? Big ears? Fallen arches? A good memory? Is this point process arbitrary? Self-rating doesn't appear objective. We could hardly view ourselves objectively if we describe ourselves with a one-dimensional label. Example: "I'm an idiot." Further self-rating appears to lead to intense and enduring emotions. Self-rating can be found in anxiety, depression, guilt, and shame. In anger we find self-rating in the form of other rating. Example: "That goof!" A negative self-label can be very unmotivatiing. Generally we act in accordance with how we perceive ourselves. If we see ourselves as failures, no good, or fools we will tend to act that way. Better we view ourselves as multi-faceted persons for that's who we appear to be. Self-rating and self-labeling can hinder our goals. If we believe we could become losers, failures, or some other negative label as the result of losing or failing, we can become anxious about do the task. This can defocus us from our activity. And if we fail at a task, wel will face the feelings we create when we negatively label ourselves "failures". Self-rating creates problems when we predict the future. If we negatively rate ourselves "I'm inadequate", we'll tend to envision a negative future. Seeing this negative outcome is highly unmotivating. Self-rating sets up magical goals. We may attempt to be "superior" to others. We are not super-human or subhuman, yet a strong case can be presented for us being fallible humans who make errors from time to time. Truly we are multi-faceted persons with many positive, neutral, and negative qualities. We can rate our behaviors and traits, yet problems arrive when we started rating ourselves up and down by our not so hot behaviors and traits. Better to note that we sometimes act foolishly, than to say we're fools. We can accept ourselves by refusing to rate and label ourselves or by viewing ourselves as multi-faceted persons. We can find instant grace by simply choosing to drop self-labeling and self-downing or by recognizing our multi-faceted self. Negative self-labels offer us excuses not to change behaviors and traits. We act in harmony with our label. If we believe we are "no good", we might be more tempted to not change our behavior. By refusing to label ourselves and rate ourselves or by accepting ourselves as fallible, yet multi-faceted persons, we will be less subject to intense and enduring emotions and will be more willing to take risks by Steve Mensing "What are some strategies for overcoming bad self-images? Do you experience that a bad self-image can be overcome?" Yes a poor self image can be overcome. I've seen that happen many, many times. It can be brought about in a number of ways: (1) Clearing those Personality Clusters/identities. (2) Accept ourselves or love ourselves irregardless of whether we do positive or negative things. We always have that choice not to knock ourselves when we invariably make errors. (3) Take actions in our lives that create positive experiences of success, yet not rate our selves by them. Focus on the vital and absorbing activity of doing. Soaking up enjoyment. Self-images are entrancing beliefs. Bad self-images fall into this category because they twist our perceptions in a way that distort how we see this self. They show us only a negative picture and engender negative feelings and pictures of negative possibilities. Bad self-images are grist for the clearing mill. They are illusions like even positive self-images, but the negative self-images make life feel lousy and our possibilities appear poor. Bad self-images run anxiety, depression, guilt, and shame. These are those distorted images that make us appear bad, worthless, foolish, dumb etc. They predict and help create poor outcomes and block motivation. I promote the way of UNCONDITIONAL SELF-ACCEPTANCE and SELF-LOVE and am 4 square against most self-esteem systems with their destructive self-rating system. In Unconditional Self-acceptance and Self-love we can always choose to accept ourselves, love our selves, and treat ourselves in a loving and compassionate manner. No matter how great, average, or how crummy our performances are. It is a waste of time to put ourselves down for our human fallibility. We can choose not to do so. We can motivate ourselves with the positive experience of being absorbed in the moment and not by fearing a negative self-rating. The negative-self rating will create a negative trance identity that will self-perpetuate itself. If you believe you're bad--how do you think you will act? How will the present, past, and future appear to you. Any form of self-rating will help spawn and reinforce trance identities or Personality Clusters. We can clear our negative trance identities and learn to accept and love ourselves no matter what. There is no universal law that says we can't. We make the choices unless we are run by some trances that mitigate against this experience. All self-attacks are based on distortion. When we label ourselves a fool or worthless we are seeing only one of our qualities and traits. We have literally millions if not billions of traits and behaviors. It is arbitrary and self-defeating to knock ourselves by our mistakes. But a trance identity will make it appear to our highly constricted view that we are this one trait or behavior and that is all we are. Absurd! We have many, many positive, neutral, and negative traits and behaviors. Why would we choose just one or a few to view ourselves by? We do have a choice. To accept and to love or to up and down ourselves by some completely arbitrary standard. I have signed a pact with myself to accept, love, and treat myself compassionately no matter what. It's easier. I enjoy the vital absorption of the moment--the flow. I don't bother with upping myself or downing myself. Many times my smaller self is not even present when I am pulled into the heart of the moment. Trances and Personality Clusters will pull us out of the moment with their dire needs to stay on the up and down stairway of self-esteem and its silly call for proving a self (a belief) and either patting it on the head or kicking it in the shins. There is a better way. I subscribe to the gospel of UNCONDITIONAL SELF-ACCEPTANCE and SELF-LOVE. Available at any moment. Free. Automatic grace. Goes with the turf of being cleared of negative self-images. Here are three Personality Clusters to be cleared: INFERIORITY/SHAME: This cluster leaves us feeling defective, inferior, no good, and undesirable. With this cluster we are sensitive to criticism and rejection and are shamed by our appearance and flaws. Beliefs are: * Who would love me if they noticed my flaws? * I've got tons wrong with me. * How could anyone love me. * They would leave me if they knew the real me. * I'm unsuitable and unlovable. * I'm drawn to others who are critical of me or reject me. * Nothing I can do will help me gain the love I want from others. * It's my fault that others don't accept or love me. * I must prove my worth. * I've got to hide myself from others who get close. * I don't want anyone to see the real me. * I feel like a fake when others appear to like me. * No matter what I do, I still feel unacceptable and unloved. FAILURE: This cluster provides us with a sense that we will fail at everything we try because we are dull, inept, unskilled, or untalented. Beliefs are: * I can't perform as well as others. * I'm a failure. * I'm no good at anything so why bother. * Whatever I do is doomed. * Others are more capable than I am. * If I failed once I will always fail. * I lack the talent and skills that other people have. * My failures haunt me--Why would I want to go through failure again. * I'm born under a bad sign. * Others are so much more successful than I. * Trying only leads to humiliation. UNDESIRABLE: This cluster points to being unwanted due to physical appearance or lack of social skills. Beliefs are: * I'm fat and unacceptable or unlovable. * I'm skinny and unacceptable and unlovable. * I'm ugly--I'm boring--I make dull conversation and am unacceptable and unlovable. * People won't hang out with me because of my race, low status, poor income, education, or lack of social skills. * I can't say the right things--I feel so out of it. * Others don't want me in their circles. * I feel very self-conscious around others. * I start talking to people and they immediately excuse themselves. The above beliefs and their attendant feelings can be targets for clearing. People tend to create these crummy and self-defeating images in the following contexts: * You were treated in a critical, downing, and punishing way in your family of origin. * You were frequently blamed when things went wrong by parents or siblings. * Early teachers put you down for your behavior and school activity. They focused negatively on you and not your actions. * You were told you were no good, sick, or worthless on an ongoing basis by an important other. * You drew negative comparisons with siblings. * You were blamed for one of your parents abandoning the home. * You were physically abused. * You were emotionally abandoned by your parents. There's much more to add to this very important picture. Take care, Steve |
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JayneBurgos |
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Posts: 40 (08/09/08 02:26 PM) |
Hi,
Here is the Self-Defeating Behavior Test. It's invaluable for knowing if a behavior is self-defeating for you. Ask yourself these questions: *Is this behavior something you want? *Does it improve your life or ability to perform? *Does it fit with your short-term and long-term goals? *Does it keep you out of significant conflict with others? (unless the conflict is something you prefer). *Does it effect either your physical or mental health? *Could another behavior work better for you? *Will this behavior effect your other behaviors adversly? *Is it right for the context where it's employed? *Does it fit with your values? *Are there future consequences for this behavior? *What might make it difficult to perform in some instances? *How will this impact on your relationships? Jayne Burgos |
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